Re: Dismantle IAS, IPS etc..

["Krishnan Kandasamy" <nkandasamy@hotmail.com>]

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First of all, Thanks Mr.Venugopal for some of the excellent points raised by
you regarding the above suggestion. Let me try to address them one by one.

"The Worth of a State, in the long run, is the worth of the individuals
composing it" -J.S Mill

"We put too much faith in systems, and look too little to men" -B.Disraeli.

The above quotes are from the book Self-Help by Samuel Smiles, which I think
are relavent here.

What is needed is that power of an individual should rise, he/she should not
be blinded or harmed by the "system". In India, the system is demonised to
such an extend that people are afraid to voice their concerns. Very
typically it the criminals that take the initiative and they are the ones
ruling us.

We are afraid to raise our voice aganist the postman who is rude, aganist
the lowly peon who wants a bribe. Because the fact of the matter is even
those lowly govt lepers can cause you harm if they want to.

So, how do you distroy this monster "system"- Break it in to million pieces.
That is how!, why instituzanise that buracracy?. Lets break it. Make every
individual count.

Today in India, bankers, telephone employees and others virtually threaten
the Govt. aganist privitazation because the babus are afraid of losing their
cosy, adapted corrupt ways.

We must be dreaming to expect that babus and netas will give up the cash
cows of the Govt Industry and fully supprot private initiative.

In a society where individual freedom and power is made superior based on
his or her high moral grounds, the system will buckle, howmuch ever corrupt
it might be.

It is not that we have to root out corruption 100%, because some individuals
will always be corrupt, but the "system" should not be corrupt or protect
the corrupt.

In order to get a promotion in police service, it is common that you have to
bribe the higher ups, so the local police wallah goes about taking bribes:
That is the only way that he can survive.

Honest individuals like Mr.Sanjeev have to bribe somebody to escape from
bribary.

Now, answers to your questions.

>1. What would we do after abolition or dismantling of IAS, IPS etc? Do
>we plan to hand over the jobs to the ruling party? Which party? How do
>we ensure that the party gives less bureaucratic services than the
>present bureaucracy?

Recruit directly for any job. Even in U.S bureaucracy can be a pain!, O.K.,
lets say for MTNL or BHEL , instead of appointing a IAS (Indian Aristocracy
Service)lords, appoint an person who knows the job.

Genius administrators don't come out of current "experienced", cosyed up,
self-glorified bureacractic sewer pool.


>2. After the services are abolished, how does government run? Is it
>through private people on contract service? Is it a short-term contract
>for one year or three years, Or, is it long term contract for 20 years?
>If it is short-term, it simply cannot work because the chap wont
>understand the work. If it is long term, how would it be different from
>the present ones we have anyway?

Performance and individual interest, when individual is empowered, he or she
will join the system (Police) and make it more worthfull.  police system
will be composed only of those individuals, who are motivated enough to do
that job.


3. Did we make enough efforts to 'tame' the bureaucracy within broad
>framework of rules and regulations? There are conduct rules, there are
>rules governing anti-corruption. Are we using system of incentives and
>disncentives which are permitted within the rules, in order to recognize
>and encourage good ones and punish bad ones?

Regualtions don't work if the implementors themselves corrupt.
Incentives are abused and disincentives are used to punish the good ones.

Let me one thing clear, noboby should feel that they should be honored
because they are honest, It is a human and society obligation. Too often,
that honest people, go in to the self pity mode.


>4. Who is the boss? In a democracy, people are supreme. Democracy does
>not mean just having elections every five years. It is essentially
>enabling citizens to participate more in governance. How many of the
>citizens feel like participating? Why do educated citizens feel that it
>is not their job to take the trouble of filling in a
>complaints/suggestion form, wherever it is available? Of course some
>citizens' forums are coming up, taking up issues like transparency,
>right to information and anti-corruption. There is definitely need for
>more such organizations and more meaningful participation by people at
>large in matters of governance, whether it is civic facilities,
>development projects, or even basic law enforcement. After the IAS and
>IPS are abolished, what exactly will change? Will there be education for
>everybody and health facilities and drinking water for all? Who will do
>it? Will private sector come forward to do this type of 'non-profit'
>work? Yes, there is a great deal of scope for NGOs to play. But, is
>anybody stopping them now?

Chennai Municipality for example uses 95% of the taxes it collects to pay
salary to its employees and it has no money to do some thing for the city.
So I have to pay my hard earned cash to pay salary to that thug, who will
abuse me and ask for bribe, if I go to him for a "approval". What is the
use?. Nothing is being done anyway?. Why not abolish salary and make bribe
as the means for compension.

Power of individuals is great. Gandhi and others would have been overwhelmed
by the british, but they kept at it. It is hard to fight the evil britishers
or the system by if individuals can slowly chip, poke and bite this monster,
soon there will be million individuals biting this monster and it will die.
Enough number of ants can distroy an elephant.

Who don't the industry group have the guts to say that they will not bribe
the babus?. Why can't the shopkeepers association, and the resident of a
colony just declare boldly that no bribe will be given of taken?.


This monster is evil but has weak spots. If thousand individuals go to the
local telephone company and demand proper service, these minions will be so
afraid that they will *** in their pants.


5. There are many countries like New Zealand that have attempted basic
>civil service reforms. The model there is broadly, something like having
>a Memorandum of Understanding between the Head of the Department and the
>Minister before beginning of every year. Once the MOU is finalized with
>clear statement of targets, the Minister will not 'interfere' in the
>work of the bureacrats. The Head of the Department in turn, engages
>people selected on his own/ her own to undertake the work. Broad
>contours of the work on what kind of services to be provided, in what
>manner they are to be provided etc are all decided in the MOU. The
>remuneration, service conditions etc  of all the people down the line
>are l decided by the Head of the Department.At the end of the year, if
>the concerned Head of the Department fails to deliver, he/she is chucked
>out.  For those interested in knowing more about civil service reforms
>in different countries, read book "civil service reform" by S.K.Das, who
>happens to be an IAS officer. Of course, the questions which need to be
>addressed are: How can this model be cost-effective, considering our
>backward level of economic development? There are always some honest and
>efficient civil servants of all ranks and all categories. They are
>making tremendous efforts to uphold the rule of law, to ensure proper
>procedures in the larger interests of justice and fairplay, taking
>enormous personal risks.. Would the new system protect such civil
>servants who may be saying 'no' to the boss too often? How do we know
>that the remedy is not worse than the disease? Even if it is good and
>desirable, how does one convince the elected government about the need
>to undertake such reforms?

Elected government should be infiltrate by people from IPI and other NGO's.
If enough honest people get in to that stinking pool and clean it and
instead of stay away and complain about the smell, too bad!.,

In order to clean an dirty pond enough fresh water has to be brough in!


>I end here by saying that a well-thought out and practical action plan
>to reform the civil service is welcome. But, merely saying 'dismantle
>services' will not take us anywhere.

You don't have to agree with me on every thing but let IPI member
think/debate  and have a little bit of faith that they can make an
difference.


Hit them where is hurts, these Govt rascals are a just a few million we can
surely teach them and make them behave properly if individuals take the
initiative and start choking them!

No apologies for any body!

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